I have scenario that I would like to ask some advice about. I am the sound engineer for a local band and I am using an SQ-6. The guitar player uses a Quad Cortex amp modeler connected to SQ input via XLR. I put his output volume at 80 (out of 100) and on the SQ-6 I have the preamp gain at about 10db in order to get the majority of the signal in the green, as close to 0 as possible. He uses quite a bit of compression on his sound (on the Quad Cortex), country chicken picking with a Telecaster. When he’s strumming etc. channel meter looks good, but when he leans in to the picking part the meter jump up to +10db in the Yellow, once in a while will even hit +12. If I reduce the gain, the singer complains he can’t hear the guitar. So, I also put a compressor on the guitar channel. 1176 style, with a 12-1 ratio, fast attack, fast release and just enough input to “catch the peaks”. The compressor does engage on those “picking” parts, but the channel meter still jumping like crazy.
So, am I doing something wrong, or that’s the way it is and don’t worry ? It does NOT clip but with significant compression at source, plus my own channel compression I would expect the meters to be stable and not jump more than +3 … that is not the case. I know… mix with your ears not your eyes but it bothers me to see the meter get so high.
Should I have his Quad Cortex, or any other Line Level device for that matter, set to 100 full volume and not use any Preamp Gain ?
Again, maybe this is all fine… but I don’t like to see the channel meter jump to +10 or more, when the majority of the time it’s at 0 ish.
gain meter
When he’s strumming etc. channel meter looks good
The compressor does engage on those “picking” parts, but the channel meter still jumping like crazy.
It sounds like you’re always measuring at the same source.
Could that be?
What are your gain meter and your channel meter?
Otherwise: You yourself write that you should mix with your ears.
Perhaps you should just allow the instruments more dynamics.
I could well imagine that perhaps these peaks in picking are the icing on the cake.
According to the block diagram in the user manual, the input channel meter is located after all channel processing. Therefore it should reflect the effect of the compressor.
There are two things that I think are playing into the situation you are seeing…
First, you need to keep in mind that the compressor’s meter and the channel’s meter likely have different velocities, reaction times, and other internal settings that affect how they visually display the signal. This means the fact that the compressor might show a reduction of 10db doesn’t mean that the channel meter would also show the exact same 10db affect at the exact same moment in time. It could be the compressor meter is “behind” the actual output of the compressor - especially when the compressor is set with with very fast release times.
That leads me to the second point… I think your compressor settings are such that it isn’t compressing hard enough and long enough for the channel meter to really be affected by it. The 1176 is a very fast acting compressor and with a “fast release time”, it could be that the compressor is releasing so quickly that the channel meter isn’t really being affected by the compressor. Combined with the fact that you are only trying to “catch the peaks” and that leaves a lot of room for the input to actually increase in volume. As a test, I suspect if you lengthen the release time and/or increase the threshold of the compressor, you will find that the channel meter begins to act more like you expect.
In the end, you have to realize that meters are just a tool. Furthermore, the meter’s velocities, reaction times, and other internal settings absolutely change how the meter reacts to a signal. Some of the higher end A&H systems allow a user to tweak some of these settings and you can wildly change how the meter looks/reacts to the same exact signal. Therefore your ears are the most important tool you have at your disposal and you should always trust your ears more than the meters. The meters are a helpful tool, but they shouldn’t be considered “perfect” by any stretch of the meaning.
Thank you everyone for your great feedback / advice. Much appreciated. Brian, I did notice that the meters on the input gain on the LCD screen were different than the main board meters (LEDs) when using PAFL. The main board meters were lower than the LCD gain meters by about 3db. The SQ does have a few meter settings in terms of the LED color, when does Yellow come on vs Orange etc… I might look at what it is set for.
As for compressor, I’ll check the source as well as the SQ and adjust the settings ie: ration, attack and release to see if I can get a bit more “control” of that signal.
I’ve read another post here that a SQ user was saying the mixer did not have a lot of headroom and when signals get a bit hot ie: yellow or slight above, it did not sound great. I have experienced this with my own specific SQ-6 unit as well. I’ve had a few band members tell me they were hearing distortion in their IEMs, even though the AUX level was at Unity and the send faders were lower than Unity for the most part. Once I reduced the gain on the input so that it stayed mostly away from the yellow, it was fine. Now, the Yellow which starts above 0 and goes to about +10, is still below clipping, so technically the sound should not distort. In the main PA from 30 feet away with the entire band playing, I cannot hear any distortion caused by “too hot” of a signal, but I can imagine that for individual members on IEM and their own instrument at Unity, they would be able to hear any degradation in sound ie: distortion etc…
I’ve always felt, since I got my SQ in 2019, that this unit really does not like to be running to “warm / hot” of a signal. In any case, I will check compressor settings, meter ballistics and try to get a more stable signal that stays at the top of Green.
I’ve read another post here that a SQ user was saying the mixer did not have a lot of headroom and when signals get a bit hot ie: yellow or slight above, it did not sound great.
Can you link it?
Maybe he meant something different or you misinterpreted it.
The headroom is 18 dB and the mixer sounds great in that range too.
I’ve had a few band members tell me they were hearing distortion in their IEMs, even though the AUX level was at Unity and the send faders were lower than Unity for the most part.
I think it might have more to do with the inputs (or their settings) of the IEM transmitters.
It likely depends on the preamps you are using. I know that the “DLive” preamps actually are the opposite - a lot of engineers like the sound of them when they are run very hot.
The preamps in the DX and GX stage boxes are the same preamps as the DLive. However the built in preamps in the SQ are different. So if you are using the built in preamps, it could result in a different experience than if you used the preamps in DX/GX stage boxes.