Say if I as Admin reserve Scenes 1-9 for admin use and just allocate Scenes 10-100 for Standard users, and if I setup Scene 1 as the DEFAULT scene with all the main parameters like routing etc set up here.
Is there a way that I could allow a Standard user to automatically open Scene 1 when they log in so they always log into the DEFAULT scene with the correct settings, but restricting them from writing over Scene 1 by adjusting these settings and pressing save. In other words just allow them Read only access to Scene 1?
Copy your scene 1 to a new scene 10 ?
Giga
Giga, I already do this but on a number of occasions one of the Standard users make changes in Scene 10 (such as switching off routing by accident) and then save the scene, so when next Standard user logs in and uses Scene 10 there will be a routing (or whatever) problem.
The only way to avoid this is if Scene 10 was able to be made ‘read only’ and couldn’t be overwritten, but I can’t see from manual a way to have this setup?
Did the method suggested here:
https://community.allen-heath.com/forums/topic/default-scene-read-only
not work?
Can’t you get away with letting them log in as a Basic user only ? Or maybe give all of your Standard users their own default scene with their own password. In the home - User screen you have the possibility to set permissions per user also.
Giga
Mark do you mean this suggestion from Dr Dave:
“Define a scene range for standard (and basic) users (eg 16-100). Define a start scene (eg 15) outside of that range. Put a scene recall for the start scene on a soft button. Set a password for the top level user. Whenever a user logon occurs, or whenever the soft button is pressed, the start scene will be recalled, resetting any parameters which are not made safe.”
But is he not talking about having to press a soft key in order to recall the default Scene (which is outside the Standard user scene range). I don’t think the standard users will always remember to press a soft key… In any case if they did press the soft key and the default Scene 1 was recalled, would they be able to adjust settings and save or will they be blocked from saving??
I don’t know if it works, I’ve not tried it. DrDave says it does though, and I’d assumed that you would have given it a go, as it seemed to be what you were asking for???
It seems that revocing the permission for both routing options for the standard user would solve the problem where one of your techs accidentally screws up the routing. Give it a try !
Giga
OK - Just tried doing what DrDave suggested - mainly out of curiosity.
So the recall scene on a softy does work, even it the scene is outside the range that the user can select. But better than that, the default default user scene can also be outside that range. Which I think is exactly what you wanted?
As they can’t get to it in the scenes screen, they can’t overwrite it.
Alternatively, you’ve got 15 Soft Keys to play with if you use an Qu-Pad, (or Qu-Control on a phone) so you could set up to 15 different stating points that users can recall after logging in
- Just noticed what auto correct has done to “Soft Key”, but I like it so it can stay!
I just tested the Scene ‘Read only’ setup and it works, without need for Softkey.
So I logged in as Admin and then selected Standard user and selected Scene 1 as the User Scene and Scene 10-100 as the Scene Range for Standard users. So the Admin has Read & Write access for Scenes 1-9, and the Standard user has Read & Write access for Scenes 10-100, and Read only access to Scene 1 on startup. So if I make Scene 1 the DEFAULT scene with all the correct routing etc, then every time a Standard user logs in it will automatically be on this default Scene 1. He can still tweak settings (and even change the routing, I think?) when in this scene during the service but he can’t then save these as Scene 1, he can only save to Scenes 10-100.
This is ideal, so I will instruct the Standard users to simply log in and set up the Sunday sound from Scene 1. If for example they are in during the week to set up for Sunday (e.g. for band rehearsal) then they set up from Scene 1 and then save to a scene within their range, e.g. Scene 11.
Thanks Dr. Dave and others…
This is what I was wanting all along, read only access to the default scene, but I didn’t know that Standard users could be automatically logged onto a scene on startup outside of Standard user range, is this only a recent upgrade add-on or was this facility there all along?
Yes, this procedure, without softkey, has been in operational use at my church for over 2 years now.
Be careful though with your shutdown and startup procedures: the start scene is only recalled if you actually logon. If you just cut the mixer power after messing with routing settings, then when you apply power again I don’t think you will be asked to logon, and all the messed up settings will be preserved.
But then, that isn’t that what you would want if you had a power cut mid-performance?
Hi Dave
Earlier today I was in church and tried this logon procedure again as described in my previous post, but discovered a glitch…
So when I log in as Admin and then log out and shut down, and then when I log back in as Standard it automatically opens Scene 1, all good so far.
But…if I log out and shut down after being logged in as Standard user and then log back in again as Standard user, it doesn’t open Scene 1 but opens the first scene in the Standard range, which in my case is Scene 10 !!..not so good!
I wonder is there a way to keep Scene 1 automatically opening up whenever a Standard user logs in??
Manual says:
You can assign a User Scene to recall automatically when the User logs in. This recalls when the User is changed, not when the same user logs back in after power up.
So I guess this is intentional behavior to start with whatever state was active when powered down. Probably needs an additonal “Always load Scene” checkbox.
So, back to the Soft Key plan for now…
The different login method works well for my church, as services alternate between using the Basic and Standard user types; the volunteers at the traditional services are actually pleased that they are locked out of using the scary knobs etc used for band-led worship services, and have the assurance that the system behaves always in exactly the same way. Only once have I been called out - an earlier operator had powered down the system with a global mute, and the visually-challenged volunteer switching on the system didn’t notice the logon prompt on the touch screen.
As Andreas points out, the startup scene recall only takes place on power-up if the User type changes, and to me that is a good thing if you momentarily lose power for instance.
The Soft key plan should be OK; we use a Soft Key scene recall approach from a protected range of scenes for rearranging the loudspeaker routing for a simple service in a side-chapel, and this is available to Basic users.
Dave I tried setting up the soft key but it didn’t work. I must be missing some step in the procedure.
I logged on as Admin and then selected Standard user and then went to Setup…Control…SoftKeys, and selected Key 3 as Recall Scene (and I already set Scene 1 as the startup User Scene for Standard user) and pressed Apply. I then logged out, powered down, powered back up and logged on as Standard user and selected a scene (Scene 11) and pressed SoftKey 3, but it didn’t change the scene to Scene 1. Any ideas what I did wrong?
Did you block softkeys from being reloaded on scene change? See The Filter Screen on Page 60 in The Manual.
I don’t think so Andreas as a red dot on filter button would appear on all the scenes and I don’t ‘recall’ seeing that, but I will check tonight.
Just a query on the overwriting (or not) of parameters upon scene recall.
Say I have ‘Mute all channels’ on Softkey 1, ‘Mute channels 21-24 only’ on Softkey 2. But in Scene 11 I block Softkeys, so if I am in Scene 8 Softkeys 1 and 2 would have the above mute functions active but if I recall scene 11 there would be nothing assigned to Softkeys 1 and 2, yes?
But when the manual says “Blocked parameters – These are not overwritten when the scene is recalled”, I’m not sure I understand what is overwritten means? So taking the above example, if I recall Scene 11 (which has the Softkeys parameter blocked), that sentence would then mean that “Softkeys are not overwritten when the scene is recalled”, but overwritten with what? If it said that a parameter is or isn’t loaded when a scene is recalled that is clear, but the term overwritten is confusing, to me anyways?
Ok, I’ll try to explain… 
Any scene essentially contains the complete mixer setup, including settings for each channel strip, routing and the soft key assignments. This is great if you frequently move the setup betweeen totally different locations.
Without any filter loading a scene will restore that complete setup. So, if you assign a soft key, store that as Scene 1 and then recall Scene 11 this assignment is overwritten with whatever contained in Scene 11 for that key.
Using the “Block SoftKey” filter will load a Scene without touching those assignments (last assignment maintained). This can be specified per scene or globally (for all scenes).
You probably prefer to use the global Block SoftKey filter to not edit any scene available for your “normal” users, so it is irrelevant which scene they recall, softkeys stay assigned.
Problem is, that if some admin user changes the assignments, they do not come back when loading Scene 1 as well.
So maybe setting a Scene Filter for each of the User Scenes would be the better approach and loading Scene 1 also restores the default softkey assignments.