Has anyone got any experience with Dante not working properly with long (around 80 m) cable runs?
High quality Cat5-cable, 80 meters, 10 ms setting on DVS: random clicks/pops
Very short cable, laptop next to stage rack: Dante working fine.
Obviously it’s the cable. What kind of brand are you using?
Cat 5 doesn’t support 1000mB speed, although your router, laptop etc. Say they have a 1 gigabit connection. It’s a grey area, cat 5 will run gigabit but not garanteed. Cat 6 cable should work according the standards. Look on the wikipedia for all the cable standards iso-norm etc.
Maybe audinate has a recommended cable list…
Good luck,
Gijsbert
Use at least cat 5E cable
Cat3= 10 mB
Cat5=10/100mB
Cat5E=10/100/1000mB (short distances)
Cat 6=100/1000mB
Doh! Thank you, sir!
Mmm, sounds more like clock source not being set correctly…
Dante does not require gigabit network by default.
Gigabit is only needed if the amount of channels requires more bandwith than can be handled by 100mbit network.
Wouter
IDR32, Dante, Mixpad
laptop, TP-Link TL-WR1043ND</font id=“size1”></font id=“navy”>
Everything was set correctly, including clock source etc.
As i wrote - long cable: clicks/pops, short cable: working.
I was recording 42 channels of audio, and by default my laptop/DVS chose gigabit network.
Hi Kole,
What Wouter was saying makes sense. Just because one cable is working and the other one isnt, it doesnt mean it is a cable length issue. I had my system set up and i was having the same issues, except my pops and clicks were on the “short” cable side of the system. Once i fixed my clocking issues, everything worked fine.
Start by making sure that “sync to external clock” on the dante controller is selected for the dante card that is on your console. At least that was the problem that i had.
Gil Parente
Design & Integration
Entertainment Arts, Inc.
Hi All
Gigabit Ethernet is designed to work in existing Cat5/Cat5e/Cat6 infrastructure, at up to 100 meters. The problem with this specification from an audio point of view is that a certain bit error rate is allowed at this length. For most IT applications, any transmission errors are recovered by TCP/IP, by retransmitting the information. With Dante or any low latency multichannel audio over Ethernet protocol that I’m aware of, bit errors will always correspond to missing or repeated audio samples at the receiving device, as there is not time to go back and wait for the sample to be transmitted again. For this reason, it is not safe to assume that 100 meters (or any particular length, really) will be error free in all scenarios. For ACE, A&H manufacture every device using the same hardware, so we are able to approve a list of cables that all work to a certain distance. In the case of Dante, this is not really possible, as laptops, switches, and other devices you may be using, can use any of dozens of possible Ethernet interface chips, creating hundreds of possible combinations of hardware that would all have to be tested if we were to be able to gurantee some particular cable type and length will work without errors.
This is not all that helpful for you guys trying to set systems up. Assuming that good quality cable is being used, the main cause of errors will be poorly (I really mean ‘not perfectly’ here) terminated connectors, so if you have a longer cable that doesn’t seem to work properly, you could try recrimping the connectors, making sure to only untwist the bare minimum of each conductor pair, and to get the ends of the conductors right to the end of the RJ45 plug (you can check this by holding the end of the plug up to the light and looking to see that all the shiny conductor ends reflect together). Another thing you might be able to try is to use the cable diagnostic feature that some Ethernet interfaces provide as part of their software drivers. The more sophisitcated implementations will tell you if there are any imperfections in the cable simply by running a short test with the cable plugged into the computer.
In general, with good quality cable and Ethernet hardware, you should be able to run 100 meters and never have an error. I suppose I just wanted to explain why you can’t simply look at the Ethernet spec and say “100 meters will work”, no matter what.
Hope this helps.
Cheers
quote:
Originally posted by gilparenteStart by making sure that “sync to external clock” on the dante controller is selected for the dante card that is on your console. At least that was the problem that i had.
I’m aware of that, I’m not a complete ignorant… [
]
Not sure I like what Jeff is writing, but it makes me wanna stick to the short cable when I’m recording!
Kole,
Is it doable to give us a list of all settings that you were using.
I hope to learn from this, or give a hint if possible.
I also need the network latency, which is not the Dvs latency, exact connections, exzct clock source settings on all devices…
Wouter
IDR32, Dante, Mixpad
laptop, TP-Link TL-WR1043ND</font id=“size1”></font id=“navy”>
quote:
Originally posted by woutertKole,
Is it doable to give us a list of all settings that you were using.
I hope to learn from this, or give a hint if possible.
I also need the network latency, which is not the Dvs latency, exact connections, exzct clock source settings on all devices…
Of course, I’ll see if i can remember:
T80 + IDR48, internal clock
Network latency: tried both standard-setting (?) and 5 ms safe mode
Dante Control panel: ticked on “preferred master” and “slave to external wordclock”
DVS: setup for 64 i/o, 10 ms latency, 48 khz
DAW: Macbook Pro 2,66 ghz, 4 gb ram, 7200 rpm HD, Reaper 4, recording 42 channels of audio. 40 channels from mixrack input + L/R ref. mix.
OS X network settings: DHCP
DVS/control panel recognized the network connection as gigabit.
And again: short cable working (no clicks/pops at all), long cable not working (clicks/pops approx. every 10 seconds on random tracks)
Next time, i’m gonna try out Cat6 og Cat5e.
By the way, the Dante primary port was connected directly to my laptop. No switches/hubs/anything in the signal path.
What computer are you using to record? I use a Mac Mini and if I leave Airport on I get clicks and pops. Turn it off and everything is fine. So if you have your wi-fi card on, and can turn it off, you might try that and see if it helps.
I too thought it was a long cable run, but it still persisted with a 10 ft (3m) cable. I just started trouble shooting and remembered that being a recommended step for Pro Tools LE. Even though I’m using reaper I thought I’d try. Sure enough. Wi-fi off and click/pops are gone too.
T112/48, MacBook Pro, D-link DIR-815, iPad 1 w/mixpad, Dante card feeding a Mac Mini w/DVS.
quote:
Originally posted by CMattEWhat computer are you using to record? I use a Mac Mini and if I leave Airport on I get clicks and pops. Turn it off and everything is fine. So if you have your wi-fi card on, and can turn it off, you might try that and see if it helps.
I too thought it was a long cable run, but it still persisted with a 10 ft (3m) cable. I just started trouble shooting and remembered that being a recommended step for Pro Tools LE. Even though I’m using reaper I thought I’d try. Sure enough. Wi-fi off and click/pops are gone too.
T112/48, MacBook Pro, D-link DIR-815, iPad 1 w/mixpad, Dante card feeding a Mac Mini w/DVS.
MacBook Pro, as written in my previous post. I too turned off wifi every time, mostly because I was thinking wifi would confuse DHCP/IP-adresses…
This is probably obvious, but some of my initial problems came from having anti-virus software active (network threat detection in particular), I always make sure it’s disabled before I start a DVS session (I double check every time, as it has a habit of restarting itself even if I’ve previously turned the damn thing off!).
Adam Biggs
iDR48 mixrack
MixRack for iPad & Tweak for iPhone apps
Asus N61 Laptop (x2 wireless)
Windows 7 Pro 64bit
with Belkin PlayMax N600 HD router
Dante card tracking into Reaper with playback via FooBar
so far my most secure setup for recording
(with 50meters cat5 self grimped)
win7 pro 64bit
no antivir installed
firewall off (i made shortcuts on the desktop)
see here:
win7 aero off (switched to xp)
boot the computer “into the dante network”
(i live on and running then turn computer on)
for us it worths it to have a cat tester see here:
cheers
dave
allen&heath iLive-144 /idr 10 / idr 48 /dante (i want midi in dante!)
Your PC may well have a cable tester built in. Gigabit network interfaces from Intel (‘Diagnostics’ in the ‘Link Speed’ tab of the interface’s device manager window), Broadcom (‘Advanced Control Suite’), Marvell (‘Virtual Cable Tester’), and maybe others, can all include various diagnostics. These tools are specific to the network interface driver, as opposed to being seperate pieces of software; I don’t know if the Mac drivers offer similar functionality.
Cheers
I guess the termination of the connectors is the issue… as Jeff pointed out before…
The networking guys control the simple settings and then the connectors if something is not working.
SRV-AVB
R-72, iDR-16, xDR-16, Dante
maybe DANTE with out the cable?
https://whirlwindusa.com/catalog/digital-audio-networking/e-beam-laser/ebeam
anybody have tested this solution?
2x iDR32 +MADI OPTION
MacBook,
desktop+2x RME HDSP MADI 2 X M DANTE CARDS
Well, it doesn’t look as a proper solution for live event. I remember these laser systems been used for internet providers, they even had alignment compensation for wall thermal movements during the year, so beam would get to the receiver. Imagine smoke, vibration, hands up in the crowd, etc.
ddff