Local IO from surfaces be able to Dante Clock Sync
This is a statement or a question?
If so, it makes no sense to me.
It is a desire and make sense if have a fixed instalation and just want to use DANTE and have dante on both Surface and MixRack and dont use gigaACE .
Nope. That doesn’t work.
If you ask why, you should learn something about the system first.
GigaACE just works.
Hi SteffenT;
I know how the GigaACE works…the problem is other…the same way it is possible to chose SyncClock in the RAcks…it will be nice to do the same on the surfaces… It is a question of simple Firmware .
???
I don’t understand what you are trying to say now.
You can choose clock sources on both, mixrack and surface, but there is only one master for the system.
Possible clock sources are, mixrack internal, mixrack BNC socket, mixrack I/O slots 1…3, surface BNC socket, surface I/O slots 1…2 and surface AES/EBU inputs.
The surface does no processing, so it just transmits control data, audio and word clock signals, to the XCVI core.
But this is totally unrelated to your drawing.
Hi SteffenR;
It is not true…You Cant chose on the Surface the Clocksource …it is all ways the clock that came on gigaACE . If for exemple you have a DANTE card on the surface you cant chose that the preamps on the surface have the clock from the dante card on it.
Steffen, I think his feature request is related to his other post in “troubleshooting”
https://community.allen-heath.com/forums/topic/installation-system-without-gigaace
He believes this could be solved with a firmware update. Only A&H could shed some light on this…
it is all ways the clock that came on gigaACE
No. It is possible to sync to the surface word clock socket. You need to configure it as input.
And of course it is possible to sync to the Dante network. No matter where the card is located.
If for exemple you have a DANTE card on the surface you cant chose that the preamps on the surface have the clock from the dante card on it.
Why should I want that?
Maybe you need to learn more about word clock?
The system needs one word clock.
The mixing engine can of course get its clock from external devices. And it can send word clock to external devices as well.
The preamps are part of the system, word clock is distributed with the GigaACE and DX protocols to all expanders or surfaces.
SteffenR;
1º In the Surface it is NOT possible to choose the clock from Dante , when you have a DAnte card on the surface ( I try it )
2º The Work Clock BNC input on the surface (when Select ) it is to be used by the gigaACE.
I gone explain again what is the idea.
I want to have DANTE card in both MIX Rack and Surface , one on each .
I Want to make TIE Lines on the surface from the Analogue IN’s and OUT’s to DANTE Card installed on it …and here start the problem…if you dont have a gigaACE cable connected dont let you make you that tielines.
The idea is have a DANTE Eco system without gigaACE.
The control can be done just with the normal ethernet port on the Mixrack and Surface…
Hope that be clear.
regards
Joao Maya
We explained you already that it is not possible to use a dLive surface without GigaACE.
The GigaACE link transports around 300 audio signals in both directions and is used as word clock and control link.
The surface is just a remote control.
There is no benefit on having a Dante ecosystem without GigaACE.
And, btw, tie lines are not what you think.
Hi Steffen;
I know that is not possible , but it is a very big backdrop for something ease to resolve.
And other think I know what tines are…we can simple for exemple send the Analogue IN1 from the surface to OUT1 of the DANTE Card on the Surface (if installed) …
In Resume we have a very nice surface (C1500 in my case) that works fine without gigaACE to controls, you just need to use a ethernet connection to switch from your fixed installation and have the Mixrack (DM0 with dante card in my case) in room far away , and use Dante Stages in any place ; but if you want the use the 8 analogue IN/OUTS from the surface and the headphone out you have to USE a DEDICATE CAT6 cable to conecte each other …not so smart when with a DANTE card on the Surface has just to tieline that inputs to the Dante outs…them I can Patch from the card DANTE on the surface to the card DANTE on the Mixrack and use normally that channel .
I can’t believe your ignorance.
The surface does nothing without the mixrack.
No routing, no processing, nothing.
And the system is build around the GigaACE connection.
Period.
If you use a dedicated VLAN you can add the GigaACE link to your house network.
Hi SteffenR;
I know that…I think you still dont understand my point.
Best Regards
Joao Maya
Your point is senseless…
It is simply not possible. The system is designed different.
I told you this, three times.
I’ve already answered the other thread but essentially, this is not possible without a fundamental rewrite of the dLive architecture. It is not just a problem of clock source. All Surface I/O (including the I/O Ports) is simply sent to / received from the MixRack engine. The Surface doesn’t really handle audio from the I/O Port other than sending it to the MixRack. You can think of the Surface I/O Ports as additional MixRack I/O Ports (which is why they are labelled 4 and 5), they simply happen to be in another physical location.
Also, the main gigaACE link is designed with enough bandwidth to transport ALL Surface I/O (including the I/O Ports) to/from the MixRack, this can easily exceed the 128ch limitation of each I/O Port. Another reason why enabling a MixRack to Surface link over a Dante card would prove problematic.
Hi Nicola ; yes I already understand that…my suggestion is, the same way you make a C1500 lighter to travel (Ti)…why not make a version of C1500 without gigaACE and only with Dante / analogue 8in/outs and phones …this will me grate for guys like me that have fixed installations .
JMaya,
SteffenR is correct. The entire dLive system is based on having a GigaACE link between the Mix Rack and surface. I do not know the internal architecture of the surface, but I know from observation that the surface does not actually do any routing. All the surface I/O (whether analog, AES, card slot ports, DX) has a fixed mapping to/from a predetermined channel on the GigaACE link. These GigaACE channels are then routed in the Mix Rack to/from other Mix Rack I/O - whether to local analog I/O. a card slot, or a surface via a GigaACE link. It is not just about surface clocking. The GigaACE link is assumed. It is a central element in the design of the system.
If you absolutely must us a dLive system, then you have been given at least two ways to use GigaACE to accomplish what you say you want to do.
If you must use dLive, and you cannot/will not use GigaACE, then here is one more option:
- Use the surface without GigaACE, and without audio, for control only.
- Instead of using a Dante card in the surface, use a separate Dante interface (or maybe more than one if needed) for whatever audio needs you have at the mix position. For example the DT168 would give you 16 preamps, controllable from the surface (probably, unless that capability relies on the GigaACE link) and 8 analog outputs. More than any C class surface. At a cost similar to the Dante64 card. Headphones and/or AES would be an issue, but one that could be solved.
Hi mstel;
All you say I already realise , and for that …is the big limitation…why the hell dont H&A just make the surface local in/outs be like a stage DT168 or DX168 but with just the in/outs they have now (6 in/outs analogue + aesebu and phones) …