Hi folks,
I figured I’d post here to see if I may be missing something…I am using basically every mix output that is possible on my qu-pac and ar2412 expander-including both matrix outs.
The reason that I’m using them all is because in our band we all use in-ears (three mono mixes and one stereo mix), and we use a different scene for each song. We move around between instruments so that means that for each song we need a different in-ear mix. Life would be a lot easier if we could just use one scene for the band, but that’s not the case.
Most of the time we play with a dedicated FOH and so we are sending individual mixes out of our expander to the FOH that are combinations of sub-mixes of multi-miced instruments and individual instruments, and vocals, etc…So that is why all of our other mixes are eaten up.
Finally, we do also occasionally play shows where we are running our own sound. In that case we are sending matrix 3-4 out to our PA and that is a matrix mix of everything.
Here is my problem that I’m trying to address:
We have four instruments that have four mics on each instrument. Each of those four instruments is currently routed to a stereo mix out and hard panned. This works fine for when we have a FOH person because they just get four line level signals to mix. The problem is when we send those to the matrix there is no way to adjust the panning without manually doing it for each scene-the hard panning remains in the matrix output and so each instrument is only coming out of one of the PA speakers.
I thought that I could use a Global Filter and set the panning the way I need at the beginning of the show, but the global filter won’t let me just control the panning-it also controls the fader of the channel (argh!).
Any chance anyone has read this far and can see a solution to this that I have missed?
phew, complicated setup. I somehow tend to recommend a rackmount mixer which merges your FOH feeds into a stereo mix for your standalone gigs. Of course this requires fixed levels since that unit is outside of Qu-automation.
What if you would route those multi-mic instruments to a dedicated dca instead of a mix ?
Giga
Does you FOH mix (when doing it yourselves) need to be in stereo?
Not knowing full details of what you do, I just guessing & thinking “out loud” here…
Could you use a couple of splitters, for something, and so send two things directly to FOH, as well as into your QU-Pack? That would free up two of the outputs you usually use to send to FOH, (maybe a stereo mix?) that you can then dedicate to being your FOH send when you need it.
Goodness. These guys wouldn’t have been able to perform if they had in my band days of the 60’s 70’s.
We were a major label 8pc touring band. We had 2 Altec speakers on sticks, Altec 5in mono mixer, Dynaco HiFi power amp with a Fisher spring reverb and NO monitors.
How did we ever do it?
2 Speakers? You were lucky…
Couldnt edit. My post should have read WOULDNT have been able.
Yes Mark. Actually in early 60’s we only had a old tube Gibson guitar amp with a Shure bullet mic. That was our PA. Then we graduated to two speakers I built(I was 15) with a Bogen tube 35watt amp.
I know these young guys get tired of hearing that crap. Just a reference point of where we’ve come from in our lifetime.
Thanks. Didn’t know you could do that.
Thanks guys-all good thoughts.
What if you would route those multi-mic instruments to a dedicated dca instead of a mix ?
Unfortunately you can’t set the DCA level on mixes the level is global.
Does you FOH mix (when doing it yourselves) need to be in stereo?
Ideally yes-we do a lot of stereo effects and when we are running our own sound it’s usually in our own small warehouse space where we are able to really push the boundaries of that stereo setup.
Goodness. These guys wouldn’t have been able to perform if they had in my band days of the 60’s 70’s.
Well as you know times change. If we were a band in the 60’s our needs and sound would probably be a lot different than they are now. Most venues we play in have very large boards with minimum of 48 channels, so a regular venue can easily accommodate our needs these days-with or without our QU-pac setup. It’s just that the qu-pac actually greatly simplifies things for everyone because instead of having the sound person set up 29 boom stands with mics, we have a built in mic array system with all the low cuts and gates already dialed in and we can just hand the FOH person 12 XLR cables of the submix to work with. So even though this sounds really complicated, it’s really made life a lot easier on everyone!
Could you use a couple of splitters, for something, and so send two things directly to FOH, as well as into your QU-Pack?
That actually seems like the easiest way to solve the issue. Thanks! All I need to do if free up one stereo channel, so we’re only talking about a couple of splitters.
I meant nothing ugly. Just showing where we have progressed. I still run large shows myself. I just get amused sometimes at what bands expect today. It’s like if they can’t have it all they can’t perform. I once did Diana Ross and Supremes. I only was asked for 3 mics. And one over the orchestra. That was it. No monitors. I could tell stories all day. We’ve come a long way.
Hey GCumbee-no ill intent perceived. I hear you! I had the qu-16 for a couple years and it worked fine for our needs. Then we needed a few more outputs, so I got the qu-pac and expander and within a couple months literally every input and output are spoken for! It’s never enough!
QUPacs are great. I’ve installed and sold several. I’m doing a large festival this weekend. Lots of bands. We’re using a QU32 on monitors. Analog splits to AR2412/084 for GLD80 on the FOH.
For installs - with a QuPac…
What control surfaces do you suggest
My industrial ones just use the front panel. I do have a couple that use either iPad or android tablet.
Could you use a couple of splitters, for something, and so send two things directly to FOH, as well as into your QU-Pack?
Gah…dangit I just realized that all the stereo tracks that we use are coming in from the USB…so no splitter is possible.
At this point I think my only option is to have two different groups of scenes: one for when we have a FOH and one for when we don’t. THat is going to make version control a pain.
I’d be happy to upload my full input list and routing if anyone felt adventurous and wanted to see if you can see a better solution than what I have come up with.
Do you always use the same FOH engineer?
Gah…dangit I just realized that all the stereo tracks that we use are coming in from the USB…so no splitter is possible.
Would it have to be a stereo track that got split? Any two sources should allow you to free up two outputs, provided they’re things that don’t need any processing changes to the FOH. May mean you have to work out a different patch system though, in which case the separate scenes may be just easy.
I don’t mind having a look at your setup in detail in you want - though it sounds like you know what you’re doing, and I’m not really expecting to find anything useful.
Would it have to be a stereo track that got split?
Yeah, it might work to do some rerouting. I could send my vox and modular synth to FOH through a splitter. If I did an a/b box splitter that let me send out of one output or both outputs at the push of a button then that could also give me the ability to talk to the band without going through FOH…hmm.
Another possibility (I’m holding my breath!) would be if A&H does an update and allows direct out for channels out of the expanders. I am eating up a few mix outs by having to send single channels to a mix just to get the the FOH. I wish they would offer a rack mount product that would let you access the direct outs. the ME-1 looks cool, but I don’t want to have to carry around a bunch of little boxes. I like to have everything racked.
